Any idea what does HD tow package do for 22 timberline?

apex96 · Mar 7, 2022

I'm of the opinion that ford is just playing the numbers/money game now. I can find no good information that tells me the rear end casing for the 3.73 gear is thicker/stronger than the 3.31 gear. With the omission of a larger radiator for the 22' models (other than timberline), the only differentiating factor for HD tow is now the fact that it comes with the TBC and PTBA standard. I have never found the PTBA useful and I had the TBC added on later. With the range of gears within the 10-speed transmission, a 3.31 geared expeditions can certainly tow 9,200 pounds (not legally according to ford). The suspensions are unchanged from an HD tow to non-HD tow expeditions (I've looked up the rear suspension components for 2018-2021 models and the springs are the same) from 2018-2021. I doubt there will be any variation in spring rates for the 22's based on the addition of the HD tow package. Most folks will need to add some type of WDH and sway control for their trailers, whether you have HD tow or not, as the HD tow is limited to 6000 lbs without a WDH according to the towing guide (2018-2021).

Ford wants you to pony up the money for the packages. I believe the vehicle is just as capable without HD tow, and parts of the HD tow package can be added on after the purchase by the owner for less.. Yes I do understand the HD tow package can help when it comes time to trade it in or sell it outright.

rd618 · Mar 7, 2022

apex96 said:
I'm of the opinion that ford is just playing the numbers/money game now. I can find no good information that tells me the rear end casing for the 3.73 gear is thicker/stronger than the 3.31 gear. With the omission of a larger radiator for the 22' models (other than timberline), the only differentiating factor for HD tow is now the fact that it comes with the TBC and PTBA standard. I have never found the PTBA useful and I had the TBC added on later. With the range of gears within the 10-speed transmission, a 3.31 geared expeditions can certainly tow 9,200 pounds (not legally according to ford). The suspensions are unchanged from an HD tow to non-HD tow expeditions (I've looked up the rear suspension components for 2018-2021 models and the springs are the same) from 2018-2021. I doubt there will be any variation in spring rates for the 22's based on the addition of the HD tow package. Most folks will need to add some type of WDH and sway control for their trailers, whether you have HD tow or not, as the HD tow is limited to 6000 lbs without a WDH according to the towing guide (2018-2021).

Ford wants you to pony up the money for the packages. I believe the vehicle is just as capable without HD tow, and parts of the HD tow package can be added on after the purchase by the owner for less.. Yes I do understand the HD tow package can help when it comes time to trade it in or sell it outright.

Odds are you are spot on with ford essentially making it a “pay for play” option. Check that box, give us 800 and you get to unlock 3000 more lbs of towing.

duneslider · Mar 8, 2022

apex96 said:
I'm of the opinion that ford is just playing the numbers/money game now. I can find no good information that tells me the rear end casing for the 3.73 gear is thicker/stronger than the 3.31 gear. With the omission of a larger radiator for the 22' models (other than timberline), the only differentiating factor for HD tow is now the fact that it comes with the TBC and PTBA standard. I have never found the PTBA useful and I had the TBC added on later. With the range of gears within the 10-speed transmission, a 3.31 geared expeditions can certainly tow 9,200 pounds (not legally according to ford). The suspensions are unchanged from an HD tow to non-HD tow expeditions (I've looked up the rear suspension components for 2018-2021 models and the springs are the same) from 2018-2021. I doubt there will be any variation in spring rates for the 22's based on the addition of the HD tow package. Most folks will need to add some type of WDH and sway control for their trailers, whether you have HD tow or not, as the HD tow is limited to 6000 lbs without a WDH according to the towing guide (2018-2021).

Ford wants you to pony up the money for the packages. I believe the vehicle is just as capable without HD tow, and parts of the HD tow package can be added on after the purchase by the owner for less.. Yes I do understand the HD tow package can help when it comes time to trade it in or sell it outright.

I would think you would be more likely to experience higher transmission temps towing at 9k with the 3.31's and I would also assume gas mileage when towing that high would be worse.

The brake control can easily be added later.

mrmustang · Mar 8, 2022

rd618 said:
Odds are you are spot on with ford essentially making it a “pay for play” option. Check that box, give us 800 and you get to unlock 3000 more lbs of towing.

Looked at the Ford parts website this AM, there is a component kit that lists out at $1,7xx that is part of the HD towing package,and while not specifically listed (my understanding is there are 30-35 different parts included in the package that get installed, how big or small is unknown at this time as I cannot find an actual production parts breakdown), I would assume a recurve of the ECU/software for the specific items included in the HD towing package, added cameras, wiring for same, brake controller integration, etc, are the added costs for the package as well.

Bill

rd618 · Mar 8, 2022

mrmustang said:
Looked at the Ford parts website this AM, there is a component kit that lists out at $1,7xx that is part of the HD towing package,and while not specifically listed (my understanding is there are 30-35 different parts included in the package that get installed, how big or small is unknown at this time as I cannot find an actual production parts breakdown), I would assume a recurve of the ECU/software for the specific items included in the HD towing package, added cameras, wiring for same, brake controller integration, etc, are the added costs for the package as well.

Bill

I wonder how many of these components are helping contribute to the GVWR increase. If the ECU is retuned to kick cooling in sooner for example, that makes sense it would increase ratings, but then I would just question why ford doesn't program that from the start, less software to maintain and better reliability long term.

rd618 · Mar 8, 2022

duneslider said:
I would think you would be more likely to experience higher transmission temps towing at 9k with the 3.31's and I would also assume gas mileage when towing that high would be worse.

The brake control can easily be added later.

Agreed. 3.73 makes a material difference, not to say someone "can't" tow 9k with the 3.31, but why risk the damage.

apex96 · Mar 8, 2022

duneslider said:
I would think you would be more likely to experience higher transmission temps towing at 9k with the 3.31's and I would also assume gas mileage when towing that high would be worse.

The brake control can easily be added later.

Not necessarily; when placed in TH mode the ECU, PCM and TCM will search around to find the right gear to hold the vehicle within a certain power band range. While a vehicle equipped with a 3.73 axle may run in 9th gear, the 3.31 may instead run in 8th gear. The programming isn't going to lug the vehicle and produce unecessary heat in a higher gear if it can downshift to a lower gear, no matter the rear end gear ratio.

mrmustang said:
Looked at the Ford parts website this AM, there is a component kit that lists out at $1,7xx that is part of the HD towing package,and while not specifically listed (my understanding is there are 30-35 different parts included in the package that get installed, how big or small is unknown at this time as I cannot find an actual production parts breakdown), I would assume a recurve of the ECU/software for the specific items included in the HD towing package, added cameras, wiring for same, brake controller integration, etc, are the added costs for the package as well.

Bill

30 to 35 different parts isn't a whole lot. I'd wager 50% of those parts are fasteners or trim pieces of some sort. If for some reason ford did change the ECU/PCM/TCM mapping between the packages I'd be very surprised... If they did modify ECU/PCM programming for the HD tow package, you can pay around 500-1000 for a tuner to reprogram your non HD tow vehicle for even more power and better transmission shifting then what came from the factory, if so desired.

mrmustang · Mar 8, 2022

apex96 said:
. If they did modify ECU/PCM programming for the HD tow package, you can pay around 500-1000 for a tuner to reprogram your non HD tow vehicle for even more power and better transmission shifting then what came from the factory, if so desired.

Why bother to go through all that, spend additional money on a brake controller (Ford over the counter or otherwise), $500-$1,000 for custom tuning, when the retail price for the Ford HD towing package is only $795.00 Why piecemeal the parts together over the counter, at a cost twice that of the package parts cost alone and no install? The plus side, it's all Ford parts designed to work together for this very reason, and it's installed at the factory so you don't have to. I guess it's a matter of wants and needs, that, and what a few of us here feel is a "better to have it and not need it, than to need it and not have it". If you are ordering an Expedition from the factory and not buying something off the lot, why would you not add it to the 70K plus you are planning to spend for your Timberline.

Bill

apex96 · Mar 8, 2022

mrmustang said:
Why bother to go through all that, spend additional money on a brake controller (Ford over the counter or otherwise), $500-$1,000 for custom tuning, when the retail price for the Ford HD towing package is only $795.00 Why piecemeal the parts together over the counter, at a cost twice that of the package parts cost alone and no install? The plus side, it's all Ford parts designed to work together for this very reason, and it's installed at the factory so you don't have to. I guess it's a matter of wants and needs, that, and what a few of us here feel is a "better to have it and not need it, than to need it and not have it". If you are ordering an Expedition from the factory and not buying something off the lot, why would you not add it to the 70K plus you are planning to spend for your Timberline.

Bill

For many people it may make sense to order the package, for others perhaps not. If I was ordering it sure, add it on, but Ford really has paired down the HD tow and kept the price roughly the same. Folks are getting less for their money...

Forscan can be had for a small fee and the brake controller was about $150 on TASCA last year. Tune was $500 for tuner and program so not terrible.

To be frank, I'm not in agreement with Ford slowly removing things from the HD tow package and making you spend more for them as additional add-ons, when from 2018-2019, I believe they were all included in the package (trans cooler, upgraded radiator, PTBA, TBC, 3.73 rear end, eLSD, 4-pin and 7-pin connector). form 2020 on, Ford as methodically removed pieces that made up the original HD tow package.

I'm also not one to order a vehicle, I do prefer to check dealer lots, and find one in person that best suites my needs.

wakeboarder · Mar 8, 2022

apex96 said:
I'm of the opinion that ford is just playing the numbers/money game now. I can find no good information that tells me the rear end casing for the 3.73 gear is thicker/stronger than the 3.31 gear. With the omission of a larger radiator for the 22' models (other than timberline), the only differentiating factor for HD tow is now the fact that it comes with the TBC and PTBA standard. I have never found the PTBA useful and I had the TBC added on later. With the range of gears within the 10-speed transmission, a 3.31 geared expeditions can certainly tow 9,200 pounds (not legally according to ford). The suspensions are unchanged from an HD tow to non-HD tow expeditions (I've looked up the rear suspension components for 2018-2021 models and the springs are the same) from 2018-2021. I doubt there will be any variation in spring rates for the 22's based on the addition of the HD tow package. Most folks will need to add some type of WDH and sway control for their trailers, whether you have HD tow or not, as the HD tow is limited to 6000 lbs without a WDH according to the towing guide (2018-2021).

Ford wants you to pony up the money for the packages. I believe the vehicle is just as capable without HD tow, and parts of the HD tow package can be added on after the purchase by the owner for less.. Yes I do understand the HD tow package can help when it comes time to trade it in or sell it outright.

When I looked, it showed different options for the rear springs which included HD tow. Also 3.31 gears will have higher contact pressure at the same pulling force. Also, the 3.31 has a different carrier assembly. I’m not saying that it won’t work. I’m just saying they are different.

Any idea what does HD tow package do for 22 timberline?

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